Mr Abbott's grand plans

[Member]

Just been mucking around on my yak and stopped for the news and a beer to hear about Tony abbotts plans to look for new dam sights.

My question to everyone is Do you think he will have any chance after travesten?

Steve

[Member]

What's wrong with resurrecting Traveston.

I have had all the deep holes and snaggs plotted for 2 years.

Gordon

[Member]

Im not really for or against new dams just think they should be made properly if at all.

Does the arguement that stopped the last dam still apply / can be used against any new ones ?

Just putting it out there wondering what everyones opinions are.

Steve

[Member]

Personally the sooner we can work out a way to do away with dams the better, environmentally speaking they impact greater that they benefit. 

Mind you I'm not at all unhappy about having a couple of beauty's out the back.  Just a matter of making the most out of a bad thing

[Member]

We need them but no body wants them, we have to have them but no body wants responsibility for them, lets stick em out the back where there not seen or spoken about but when they dont work we can point the finger at them! FFS We NEED them and must have them and will need more of them, may I borrow a piece from the dear  Dorothea Mackellar....


I love a sunburnt country,
A land of sweeping plains,
Of rugged mountain ranges,
Of droughts and flooding plains.
I love her far horizons,
I love her jewel-sea,
Her beauty and her terror -
The wide brown land for me



Drought and flooding plains...........

[Member]

Put in dams in every site possible.  We have people moving over the border at an alarming rate and they don't bring their drinking water with them.

There are experts who have made a career in engineering who work out where our dams should be placed they are a lot smarter than you or I, but, they are working under a contract that said you must not go to the media and give your opinion of why this is the best place for a dam.

Their EXPERT opinions are tossed aside by the minority and the final decision made by, who.

Tell me did the NSW Government ask Slim Dusty to make a final decision on the Snowy Mountains Scheme.

Gordon

[Member]

Put in dams in every site possible.  We have people moving over the border at an alarming rate and they don't bring their drinking water with them.

There are experts who have made a career in engineering who work out where our dams should be placed they are a lot smarter than you or I, but, they are working under a contract that said you must not go to the media and give your opinion of why this is the best place for a dam.

Their EXPERT opinions are tossed aside by the minority and the final decision made by, who.

Tell me did the NSW Government ask Slim Dusty to make a final decision on the Snowy Mountains Scheme.

Gordon

The problem with that Gordon is that engineers make decisions based on a set of parameters that often don't take into account environmental issues. Traveston was a poor choice for the negative imapacts it would have had on Lungfish & Mary River Cod.
Often political agendas are the deciding factor and deals done to secure votes or kick backs. What is best is often left by the wayside.

Cania dam was a stunt by Sir Joe, a good location for building a dam, but piss poor rain patterns have meant it has never filled until recently; a 1 in a 100 year event.
Lake Clarendon was another stunt built to shore up votes for local national party member. It's a joke of a dam really, badly designed, poorly concieved & simply doesn't do what it was designed to do. An engineer with the relevant info at hand & half a clue should have either walked away or done the job properly.

Wolfdene Dam was canned on a deal that walked Wayne Goss into power in Qld. So what is right is commonly given a long walk from a short plank 

What is often never taken into consideration is the morality of a dam considering its location, design & management.

Conments like asking Slim Dusty about the Snowy Scheme is just plain silly and adds little to the debate. It's like asking me what knickers Jennifer Hawkins should wear today..... An oppinion would be given, but I doubt they'd ever ask. Did he ask the engineers to help him write his songs?? 


fitzy..

[Member]

Who made the final decision on Traveston ?

We live in a flat country and all the valleys are now real estate so the engineers have little choice but to take their plans to the outer areas.

Samford valley was on the books for a dam a long time back, imagine what that would cost to reclaim today.

Would not work, so we are left with the second best options and they will usually look ridiculous, this is probably the same over the whole country.

   (Dont worry about the Mary River Cod Fitzy, I think I have a supply stashed away)

Regards Gordon

[Member]

The paradigm is that we need more water as the population increases and to some extent that is true.  What has to go hand in hand with that is our efficiency in using that water.  Industry is by far the biggest user and is some way down the track in efficiency gains but they come at a cost so implementation is tied to profit margins. 

The issue or recycling came to a head I believe in Toowooba where the idea of shandying their piss with scheme water got a resounding 'NO' from the town (at least that was what was reported).  That clearly demonstrates what that demographic thinks of the idea and the rocky road ahead for it to be accepted by the mainstream.

Water unlike carbon at this stage has a price on it but it may be still a little too cheap to force major reforms that we will need into the future.

Dams are an efficient and relatively cheap means to collect water.  There's spin offs like power production, tourism and fishing however if you want the castrate a river there is no better way of doing it.  Some dams do become wetlands of international significance but the cost to the catchment is arguably so much more from an environmental perspective.

Whilst they are good water collectors they are not all that efficient at holding water, evaporation and leaky bottoms can pull more water out of a dam than what's required for use.  Dams can significantly raise groundwater around them leading to other problems. The land they consume can be valuable land for either production or the environment.

All that said we still need them and will probably always will in some form. However we do need to turn our focus from them to other means of providing water and get much better at using it more efficiently 

[Member]

I am in two minds about dams, but the Traveston concept was wrong on so many levels - the environmental issues as discussed, plus the effects on the marine environment in the sandy straights.  Also the removal of prime farming land close to major population areas of Sunny Coast, Brisbane and Gold Coast..  It would have been a very shallow dam and therefore suffer from evaporation. 

The government still owns the land at the Wolfdene site and could easily fire that up again.

Ultimately we need to have decent water tanks on every home in Queensland.  We survive very comfortably on ours.

Steve

[Member]

It's like asking me what knickers Jennifer Hawkins should wear today.....

C'Mon Fitz, We all know the answer to that! NONE! 

[Member]

I think storm water harvsesting certainly needs more exploration. We all know desalination is expensive, but surely the methods must be refined and tapped into, should it not?? Matt Hansen

[Member]

Mr Abbott I feel stole the idea, whilst in Emerald during the week before this happen I watch a TV interview with Barnaby Joyce in St George and this was of the proposal he suggest should be looked at for the Inland area of Qld to help prevent the floods and stop the wasting of the water.
So I feel all Mr Abbott done is jumped onto the band wagon.

Ray